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| Forum: Sports Memo Main Forum |
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| Topic: $450M for Nationals?? |
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| $450M for Nationals?? [message #516] |
Tue, 09 August 2005 09:30 |
 Brent_Crow
Messages: 1254
Registered: July 2005 |
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MLB will likely ask $450M for the Nationals to reduce the field of 8 bidders.
Quite a turnaround from the Expos, when $45M would have had trouble attracting offers.
Consider that the Brewers went for $223M in January.
Believe it or not, MLB purchased the Expos in 2002 from Jeffrey Loria for $120M. Tidy profit for MLB after this sale is completed.
http://www.washtimes.com/sports/20050809-120122-4989r.htm
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| Re: $450M for Nationals?? [message #518 is a reply to message #516 ] |
Tue, 09 August 2005 10:14 |
Teddy_Covers
Messages: 4757
Registered: July 2005 |
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The whole thing just smells bad, doesn't it? MLB essentially gives Lurie the Marlins in exchange for the Expos. They fuddle with the team for three years before finally finding them a home in DC. Now every owner in baseball stands to make ten million bucks for their mismanagement of this franchise, while fans in Montreal got screwed (both of them) and fans in DC will have to pay the price through tickets that will undoubtably be among the most expensive in baseball.
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| Re: $450M for Nationals?? [message #522 is a reply to message #516 ] |
Tue, 09 August 2005 12:22 |
Brent_Crow
Messages: 1254
Registered: July 2005 |
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not to mention a taxpayer funded stadium....
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| Re: $450M for Nationals?? [message #523 is a reply to message #516 ] |
Tue, 09 August 2005 12:35 |
Tim_Trushel
Messages: 2969
Registered: July 2005 |
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Ted,
How did the fans in Montreal get screwed?
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| Re: $450M for Nationals?? [message #524 is a reply to message #516 ] |
Tue, 09 August 2005 13:23 |
Teddy_Covers
Messages: 4757
Registered: July 2005 |
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MLB did nothing to promote the Expos. Nothing. No talk of a new stadium, no increased payroll, no give-aways -- heck, they didn't even have an Old Timers Game. In fact, they forced Montreal to play 1/4 of their home games in Puerto Rico. The league was simply willing to accept that this franchise would be moved. Let's not forget that Montreal used to draw fans when they were competitive, ie the '94 strike season. Most teams have a difficult time drawing fans when they are merely Triple A farm clubs for the rest of the league, ie Kansas City and Tampa Bay. The Expos became the first franchise to move since the Seattle Pilots moved to Texas in the early 70's. Seattle was then rewarded with an expansion franchise in '76. Don't look for Montreal to be the site of the next expansion franchise in MLB....
All six hardcore fans were disappointed 
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| Re: $450M for Nationals?? [message #525 is a reply to message #516 ] |
Tue, 09 August 2005 13:40 |
Tim_Trushel
Messages: 2969
Registered: July 2005 |
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As John Mclaughlin would say. WRONG!
Please look at these attendance figures from 1990 to 1994. Montreal was never a baseball town. The fans never showed up.
Can't expect a business to keep spending money on promotion and product if people don't want the product.
http://www.baseball1.com/bb-data/bbd-at9.html
National League Attendance
1990 1991 1992 1993 1994
------------------------------------------------------------ ------------
ATL 980,129 2,140,217 3,077,400 3,884,720 2,539,240 (54)
CHI 2,243,791 2,314,250 2,126,720 2,653,763 1,845,208 (58)
CIN 2,400,892 2,372,377 2,315,946 2,453,232 1,897,681 (60)
COL 4,483,350 3,281,511 (56)
FLA 3,064,847 1,937,467 (59)
HOU 1,310,927 1,196,152 1,211,412 2,084,618 1,561,136 (59)
LA 3,002,396 3,348,170 2,473,266 3,170,393 2,279,421 (55)
MTL 1,373,087 934,742 1,669,127 1,641,437 1,276,250 (52)
NYM 2,732,745 2,284,484 1,779,534 1,873,183 1,151,471 (52)
PHI 1,992,484 2,050,012 1,927,448 3,137,674 2,290,971 (58)
PIT 2,049,908 2,065,302 1,829,395 1,650,593 1,222,517 (60)
STL 2,573,225 2,448,699 2,418,483 2,844,977 1,866,544 (54)
SD 1,856,396 1,804,289 1,721,406 1,375,432 953,857 (57)
SF 1,975,528 1,737,478 1,560,998 2,606,354 1,704,614 (59)
------------------------------------------------------------ ------------
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| Re: $450M for Nationals?? [message #526 is a reply to message #516 ] |
Tue, 09 August 2005 17:40 |
Teddy_Covers
Messages: 4757
Registered: July 2005 |
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First of all, what's your point? That Montreal wasn't a baseball town? I agree 100%.
Secondly, the attendence figures that you posted show that when the Expos were a GOOD team, they outdrew the Giants and Astros (both top 10 markets) and were almost even with the Mets (#1 market).
Third, you are missing my point entirely. MLB got the Expos for nothing and are making $300 mil off the deal in a three year span. Good business, I'm sure you'll want to call it that. I still say, it smells bad. That's my only point.
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| Re: $450M for Nationals?? [message #529 is a reply to message #516 ] |
Tue, 09 August 2005 19:32 |
Tim_Trushel
Messages: 2969
Registered: July 2005 |
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Please re-read the post. Don't change the debate.
I asked you how the people of Montreal got screwed?
Nothing more, nothing less.
I contend they didn't get screwed. They never drew more than 1.6 million fans.
The metro area of Montreal has about 3.5 million, Atlanta about 3.7 million yet with similar records in 1994 the Braves drew twice as many fans. We all know Atlanta sucks as a sports town.
The people of Montreal did not get screwed.
They were a good team in the early 90's. They had the best record in baseball in '94 and were still outdrawn by all but three teams.
No big television contract. No fans in the stands. No baseball.
[Updated on: Tue, 09 August 2005 19:32]
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| Re: $450M for Nationals?? [message #533 is a reply to message #516 ] |
Tue, 09 August 2005 20:34 |
Teddy_Covers
Messages: 4757
Registered: July 2005 |
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OK, Mr Nitpicky, I concede. The fans (both of them) in Montreal did not get screwed.
At the time, the Braves fans were having a blast doing the Tomahawk Chop with Ted Turner and Jane Fonda leading the cheer. Atlanta, if you remember, went to the World Series in '91 and '92. They made the playoffs again in '93, losing to the Phillies.
Montreal never made the World Series. In fact, their only postseason series came in 1981, losing 3-2 to the Dodgers.
Thus, the difference in fan support is/was completely understandable. Fans support a winner.
That wasn't the point of my post. The point was that MLB making $300 mil on this deal in 3 years smelly very fishy. To this observer, anyway.
Now that you have officially 'Won' this argument, can I please get back to researching preseason football?
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| Re: $450M for Nationals?? [message #535 is a reply to message #516 ] |
Tue, 09 August 2005 22:46 |
Wha Guy
Messages: 9
Registered: October 2005 |
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| Brent_Crow wrote on Tue, 09 August 2005 12:30 |
MLB will likely ask $450M for the Nationals
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Wha?!
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| | Topic: Please help me figure this out |
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| Please help me figure this out [message #607] |
Wed, 10 August 2005 13:25 |
Tim_Trushel
Messages: 2969
Registered: July 2005 |
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Please help me figure this out
Milwaukee is down 1-0 in the bottom of the seventh
They have had few if any scoring opportunities all day. In the bottom of the seventh they have guys on 1st and 3rd with 1 out.
Ned Yost does not pinch hit but rather sends pitcher Ben Sheets to hit. Sheets squares around and bunts one right back to Suppan who turns and throws Sheets out at first. This was not a squeeze play.
Why does Yost let Sheets hit?
Why does he have Sheets square and bunt with an out already?
To make it worse, Sheets comes out to pitch in the eighth and gives up two more runs.
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| Re: Please help me figure this out [message #610 is a reply to message #607 ] |
Wed, 10 August 2005 13:44 |
Slick 1
Messages: 1190
Registered: October 2005 |
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that's why a team with good pitching isn't even in the hunt, brutal manager 
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| Re: Please help me figure this out [message #631 is a reply to message #607 ] |
Wed, 10 August 2005 16:08 |
ComptrBob
Messages: 607
Registered: October 2005 |
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Great example of some brain-dead managing.
To further compound the error, guess what Sheets' batting average is this year? That's right, 0.000, 0 fer 34. Career? Oh, say 0.083, with 137 strikeouts in 278 official at-bats.
Probably Sheets doesn't practice bunting once spring training breaks.
You just have to pinch-hit for him.
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| Re: Please help me figure this out [message #639 is a reply to message #631 ] |
Wed, 10 August 2005 17:28 |
Flipper
Messages: 1415
Registered: July 2005 |
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he must have NO confidence at all in his bullpen....
GO WEST COAST!!!
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| Re: Please help me figure this out [message #672 is a reply to message #607 ] |
Thu, 11 August 2005 08:18 |
ER_Sports
Messages: 2997
Registered: July 2005 |
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I thought an even bigger mistake was in the third or fourth with a lead-off walk to Brady Clark and Yost didn't have Weeks bunt with the 3,4,5 guys coming-up. (And I'm not one that likes to bunt) Especially with groundballer Suppan on the hill. Sure enough Weeks hit into a double-play AND Clark gets banged-up in the process. HE would of been the hitter coming up in the spot after the Sheets bunt later. The much better option to get that big base hit. Two big mistakes and it's really nothing new if you watch the Brewers day in day out.
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| Re: Please help me figure this out [message #703 is a reply to message #607 ] |
Fri, 12 August 2005 03:54 |
Zenguerrilla
Messages: 2225
Registered: October 2005 |
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I believe he decided to leave sheets in because he was pitching well and his pitch count was very low. I am sure if it would of been anyone else but sheets, he would of pulled him. I guess I don't see it as being as bad as you all seem to think but then, had I had a bet on the Brewers, I am sure I would be spitting fire out here so I can relate lol I watch a lot of brewer games ER, I can't say I agree with you that Yost makes a lot of bad mistakes all the time. He isn't no Larussa but he sure aint no BOWA either......
[Updated on: Fri, 12 August 2005 03:56]
"Lets get it on!"
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| Re: Please help me figure this out [message #705 is a reply to message #703 ] |
Fri, 12 August 2005 06:15 |
derrond82
Messages: 9619
Registered: July 2005 |
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Ned Yost has that team in the wildcard hunt and hovering around .500 for the first time in what, 10-15 years? I would consider him for manager of the year if you ask me. They are the surprise team in baseball, a minor market team with one solid pitcher who's had an injury plagued average year for him, and a bunch of no names and free agent castoffs that noone wants filling out the 25 man roster. To have the Brewers playing meaningful games in August and a chance to go over .500 is a plus. I know that was a questionable move, but he probably had a safety squeeze on and Sheets didn't execute, if he does, it's 1-1 game with Sheets still in there and Wise and Turnbow ready to close it out. I love Ned Yost, every manager has some games where they can be questioned out of 162. and maybe this one he lost I agree somewhat, but overall he's having a great year. if they can add another bat to protect Lee and another pitcher, playoffs next year is well within their reach. They are a tough team to beat in Milwaukee. They are drafting well too lately, I love their young kids coming throught their system. Maybe becoming a poor mans' A's??
Speaking of the A's, has anyone in baseball history ever put together the winning teams Beane has put together for the last 7-8 years with 1/3 of the opportunity payroll wise of his 3 AL counterparts in NY, Boston, Anaheim? The guy deserves every penny he makes in Oakland. I wonder if he could do the same job in Boston if he ever decided to take that job. He wouldn't be handcuffed, would he work as hard and as good with more resources to spend??
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| Re: Please help me figure this out [message #733 is a reply to message #607 ] |
Fri, 12 August 2005 13:07 |
ER_Sports
Messages: 2997
Registered: July 2005 |
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Sheets had only thrown 66 pitches in the game at that point. I can understand what he was thinking at won't kill him entirely, but in the context of the series and the game you NEED to give your team the best chance to at least tie the game. If the game was tied fine. But you were down 2-0 in the biggest series of the year and were getting beat in the 7th.
I don't think he's a horrible manager and he doesn't make mistakes "all the time", but in the last couple of weeks just off the top of my head he cost them a game. In Cinci on 7/24 as he didn't bring in a lefty to face Adam Dunn who beats them. Then a bit back the squeeze play gaffe. The Brew Crew is 7th in runs scored and 7th in ERA, but 9th in the standings in the NL. Again I never said the "worst", but not average as well.
The Brewers picked up his option for next year and it's a good move because this team can't afford to lose the coaches that he's assembled. The real hidden value of Ned Yost...
Follow Erin Rynning on Twitter: https://twitter.com/ersports1
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| Re: Please help me figure this out [message #754 is a reply to message #607 ] |
Sat, 13 August 2005 10:06 |
Zenguerrilla
Messages: 2225
Registered: October 2005 |
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Hehe, ya I remember that dunn dinger. That wasn't to bright lol The Sheets game was 1-0 not 2-0, stl scored 2 in the 8th and they lost 3-0, so I just don't see it as being as bad as say when he didn't bring in the lefty to face dunn lol
"Lets get it on!"
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| Re: Please help me figure this out [message #760 is a reply to message #607 ] |
Sat, 13 August 2005 12:01 |
ER_Sports
Messages: 2997
Registered: July 2005 |
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Sorry I intended the post to read the Brewers were down 2 games to zero in the series and 1-0 in the game...
Follow Erin Rynning on Twitter: https://twitter.com/ersports1
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